What you use to make beats is very important

[Fade]

There was this producer back in the 90's that released some instrumentals on vinyl and it was very hard to find. The beats were dark, gutter, and really dope. I ended up getting the series he released because I liked them a lot.

I'm not going to name him, but a few months ago I looked him up to see if he's still doing beats and he is, but his beats were straight up wack. He definitely wasn't using his old setup.

This got me thinking, and based on my own experience, what you use (hardware or software) really has an influence on how your beats sound.

When I made beats in the 90s with just hardware, they were rough. Very rough. When I switched to a computer, it was smoother. Then when I was using Maschine things changed as well. I found my beats were much smoother but I also ended up using a lot of the virtual instruments and integrated that with my samples.

Now I find myself using just an MPC and that too has changed how my beats sound. I find with the MPC, it's forcing me to make something purely sample-based (which is what I want!).

So maybe that guy from the 90's took a long break, who knows, but to hear his stuff back then and what he has now, it just got me thinking.

The same can be said for big names like Dre, for example. Hell, even Pete Rock's sound changed when he went from the SP1200 to the MPC.

I believe that whatever you're working with will obviously force you to make beats a certain way, and of course it's still up to you to make beats how you want to. But if you're just starting out, or maybe you just want to add something else to your setup, what you use can definitely alter HOW you make beats.

What do you think?

 

[Iron Keys]

Brilliant topic, my guy.

So for sure - it does!
This can even come into how workflow influences your sound. Even take for example, maybe you use an EQ that has stepped frequency ranges... that will likely change how you shape your sound.

You speak about how this guy, as a result, 'lost his sound'.
Recently I saw Timbaland talking about how changing technology has changed his sound. But he spoke of it as a positive, saying that "if I use the same stuff I was using, it sounds like it's from back then" but then, using new stuff, you have a more modern sound, but always bring with you parts of your old sound in it.

So how can we use this?!

If you're a producer out here in Ableton (or whatever), and you're wanting to make original sounding boombap... if you can't get your hands on an MPC, you'll have to start thinking in terms of how that sound was made; Program your drums/beat using drumpads; use anlogue converter emulations that can help mimic the grit and crunch of those earlier records.
If you're a producer who loves the boombap sound, but wants to bring it into the modern day, follow the methods of old but do it with new sounds and new equipment.
etc

This is one way I've been thinking about things recently.

 

[InsideOutBeats]

There was this producer back in the 90's that released some instrumentals on vinyl and it was very hard to find. The beats were dark, gutter, and really dope. I ended up getting the series he released because I liked them a lot.

I'm not going to name him, but a few months ago I looked him up to see if he's still doing beats and he is, but his beats were straight up wack. He definitely wasn't using his old setup.

This got me thinking, and based on my own experience, what you use (hardware or software) really has an influence on how your beats sound.

When I made beats in the 90s with just hardware, they were rough. Very rough. When I switched to a computer, it was smoother. Then when I was using Maschine things changed as well. I found my beats were much smoother but I also ended up using a lot of the virtual instruments and integrated that with my samples.

Now I find myself using just an MPC and that too has changed how my beats sound. I find with the MPC, it's forcing me to make something purely sample-based (which is what I want!).

So maybe that guy from the 90's took a long break, who knows, but to hear his stuff back then and what he has now, it just got me thinking.

The same can be said for big names like Dre, for example. Hell, even Pete Rock's sound changed when he went from the SP1200 to the MPC.

I believe that whatever you're working with will obviously force you to make beats a certain way, and of course it's still up to you to make beats how you want to. But if you're just starting out, or maybe you just want to add something else to your setup, what you use can definitely alter HOW you make beats.

What do you think?

Yeah I agree, Even something as simple as playing an instrument on the Mpc pads or switching to midi keyboard instead can make a vast difference in the melody I create so all equipment and methods will alter your beat making personally.

 

[OGBama]

Say @Fade who the producer is as I wanna know the series of instrumentals as I find tons of producers on IG, etc. to hear anything that ain’t Trap.

 

[Fade]

Brilliant topic, my guy.

So for sure - it does!
This can even come into how workflow influences your sound. Even take for example, maybe you use an EQ that has stepped frequency ranges... that will likely change how you shape your sound.

You speak about how this guy, as a result, 'lost his sound'.
Recently I saw Timbaland talking about how changing technology has changed his sound. But he spoke of it as a positive, saying that "if I use the same stuff I was using, it sounds like it's from back then" but then, using new stuff, you have a more modern sound, but always bring with you parts of your old sound in it.

So how can we use this?!

If you're a producer out here in Ableton (or whatever), and you're wanting to make original sounding boombap... if you can't get your hands on an MPC, you'll have to start thinking in terms of how that sound was made; Program your drums/beat using drumpads; use anlogue converter emulations that can help mimic the grit and crunch of those earlier records.
If you're a producer who loves the boombap sound, but wants to bring it into the modern day, follow the methods of old but do it with new sounds and new equipment.
etc

This is one way I've been thinking about things recently.

The part of trying to emulate is what caught my attention. That's what it comes down to at that point - TRYING to make something with technology that is not necessarily made for that. For example, the SP1200 was so limited so it forced producers to make their beats a certain way which created an entire subset of Hip Hop. With today's DAWs you can emulate whatever you want, or you can create whatever you want. That's both good and bad.

With my time on the MPC it's really shown me when you're "all in the box" it REALLY shapes your sound. Some don't like that, but I'm the type that prefers to be limited so it forces me to find workarounds. Kinda like a programmer @2GooD Productions.

Yeah I agree, Even something as simple as playing an instrument on the Mpc pads or switching to midi keyboard instead can make a vast difference in the melody I create so all equipment and methods will alter your beat making personally.

Exactly. When I did beats with a DAW and a keyboard controller it was so different than using something with pads, and I'm not even talking about an MPC. A keyboard controller vs pad controller can make a big difference.

Say @Fade who the producer is as I wanna know the series of instrumentals as I find tons of producers on IG, etc. to hear anything that ain’t Trap.

Nope.

 

[Iron Keys]

The part of trying to emulate is what caught my attention. That's what it comes down to at that point - TRYING to make something with technology that is not necessarily made for that. For example, the SP1200 was so limited so it forced producers to make their beats a certain way which created an entire subset of Hip Hop. With today's DAWs you can emulate whatever you want, or you can create whatever you want. That's both good and bad.

With my time on the MPC it's really shown me when you're "all in the box" it REALLY shapes your sound. Some don't like that, but I'm the type that prefers to be limited so it forces me to find workarounds. Kinda like a programmer @2GooD Productions.

Fully agree. Totally in-line with some other point i want to make in another thread!

My point about 'trying to make' is more about, understanding the process.

If you trying to make mpc music, but don't have mpc. If you got 16 drum pad, use that to play. If you have the emulation of the sound module etc use that. Understand the limitations of the production process back then, and mimic it.
The likeliness is most are just trying to mimic the style but using modern tech, sounds, and methods, and thus not achieving the same result

 

[Fade]

Yeah but it's not just about how it sounds, but the actual workflow. 9th Wonder did some great stuff with Fruity but there's a reason he switched to Maschine - because it makes it much easier. With Fruity it was limited at the time compared to FL Studio today, so in a sense he was working with limitations like an old school MPC. When I used Fruity I was pretty much only using it for drums because I was chopping my samples with other programs, whereas now everything can be done much more easily in FL.

One of the biggest issues I have with today's setups is that there's just too much to work with, too many options. The reason why I'm saying this is because I've noticed a lot of beats lately that are not that good, when I know they can be better. I think some guys are starting to play around with all those tools they have at their disposal instead of focusing on the simplest task: making a beat.

 

[thedreampolice]

Yeah but it's not just about how it sounds, but the actual workflow. 9th Wonder did some great stuff with Fruity but there's a reason he switched to Maschine - because it makes it much easier. With Fruity it was limited at the time compared to FL Studio today, so in a sense he was working with limitations like an old school MPC. When I used Fruity I was pretty much only using it for drums because I was chopping my samples with other programs, whereas now everything can be done much more easily in FL.

One of the biggest issues I have with today's setups is that there's just too much to work with, too many options. The reason why I'm saying this is because I've noticed a lot of beats lately that are not that good, when I know they can be better. I think some guys are starting to play around with all those tools they have at their disposal instead of focusing on the simplest task: making a beat.

9th switched to an mpc 2500 and used it for years before he got Maschine fyi.

You can get about any sound out of any setup. Hardware doesn’t have some magic sound that computers don’t. Your sound should all come from your head. That being said even using the same exact sounds you will make different compositional decisions with hardware vs a DAW. Not better or worse. Just different. With hardware it feels more like you are using a musical instrument, flaws and all. So you just are in a different flow state or state of mind. Imho

 

[OGBama]

What @Dj Iceman VSTs did you have?

 

[2GooD Productions]

I havent really worked much with hardware, Ive always been a software guy. Even within the realm of DAW's each has its own ways of doing certain things, what may be easy in one DAW is a lot harder in another. After working with a few DAW's I keep coming back to Cubase, its just a much more well rounded DAW for my workflow, it makes a couple things harder and others much easier.
DAW's and equipment isnt necessarily about the DAW or the equipment, its more about the person using them and what suits them.
Cubase suits me compared to other things Ive used. And yeah RE: VST's, I lost count of the VST's I had years ago and hardly used most of them. I tend to have my go to VST's now for everything and stick with them.

 

[Iron Keys]

Your sound should all come from your head.

*...from your soul.

 

[thedreampolice]

*...from your soul.

Sure, that’s just semantics.

 

[Iron Keys]

cats with 1000 VSTs

I used to have so many plugins.

It would have been a good opportunity to learn. But at the time it was too much. Too much for me to be able to know in a practical sense why this Pultec emulation is better than this API or vice versa or why either of them are better than just using my stock parametric.

Was too new to it all to know about hearing the difference or how to use the "limits" of these vintage emu to my advantage. For me it was just ease of use. Being able to "see" what i was doing.

Now since i went legit i was able to just use what i had, and only then could i fiure out what i was missing/needing, then go acquire it. Thennn i was able to understand how and why certain things were different.

Even using now SSL channel strips and instead of seeing my EQ curve and thinkingit looks too much or little or right, i just turn until things feel and sound right.

 

[thedreampolice]

I havent really worked much with hardware, Ive always been a software guy. Even within the realm of DAW's each has its own ways of doing certain things, what may be easy in one DAW is a lot harder in another. After working with a few DAW's I keep coming back to Cubase, its just a much more well rounded DAW for my workflow, it makes a couple things harder and others much easier.
DAW's and equipment isnt necessarily about the DAW or the equipment, its more about the person using them and what suits them.
Cubase suits me compared to other things Ive used. And yeah RE: VST's, I lost count of the VST's I had years ago and hardly used most of them. I tend to have my go to VST's now for everything and stick with them.

Cubase is probably the most well rounded DAW on the market. I used it and Nuendo for years when I was doing freelance engineering. And before I got my Pro Tools certification. Once I had that I only worked in Pro tools. I have mixed a LOT of records on cubase. These days I only mix in Logic. I actually started making music in the 90’s on hardware and have tracked bands to ADAT. So although I’m totally a computer guy. I feel pretty comfortable with hardware. Probably why Reason clicked with me all those years ago. Every record I have worked on for the last ten years has been all software and I’m happy with how it all sounds but I just wanted to change my process, just to force my brain in to a new pattern so I’m doing a record almost all hardware right now, and boy does it force you to do things different. Sampling for sure on an MPC vs Ableton or Maschine is sooo different. No way you would write in the same way. That being said, I’m pretty sure I will sell all my hardware and go back to minimalism in a year or two when I have a few records under my belt with this setup. Because man computers are so much easier. We will see.

 

[OGBama]

I believe in minimalism.

 

[2GooD Productions]

Cubase is probably the most well rounded DAW on the market. I used it and Nuendo for years when I was doing freelance engineering. And before I got my Pro Tools certification. Once I had that I only worked in Pro tools. I have mixed a LOT of records on cubase. These days I only mix in Logic. I actually started making music in the 90’s on hardware and have tracked bands to ADAT. So although I’m totally a computer guy. I feel pretty comfortable with hardware. Probably why Reason clicked with me all those years ago. Every record I have worked on for the last ten years has been all software and I’m happy with how it all sounds but I just wanted to change my process, just to force my brain in to a new pattern so I’m doing a record almost all hardware right now, and boy does it force you to do things different. Sampling for sure on an MPC vs Ableton or Maschine is sooo different. No way you would write in the same way. That being said, I’m pretty sure I will sell all my hardware and go back to minimalism in a year or two when I have a few records under my belt with this setup. Because man computers are so much easier. We will see.

yeah I hear that, speed of workflow is the most important part for me.
Using cubase I can have a track produced with a pretty decent first draft mix(as long as ear fatigue doesnt become an issue) in around 4 hours. I may cut some corners, lol.

 

[Iron Keys]

Sure, that’s just semantics.

Not really.

And even if so, words are important, they can actually change how you see things. Visually.

Someone "using their head" may approach it too technically and mechanically, formulaicly. As opposed to someone "using their soul" or heart or whatever.

Music is more about feeling than thinking.

 

[2GooD Productions]

I believe in minimalism.

you need the "feng" to make the people "sway"

 

[2GooD Productions]

Not really.

And even if so, words are important, they can actually change how you see things. Visually.

Someone "using their head" may approach it too technically and mechanically, formulaicly. As opposed to someone "using their soul" or heart or whatever.

Music is more about feeling than thinking.

agree with iron here, music comes from the soul not our heads, music is feeling and emotion based, while the technicalities may be logical and reasonable, the underlying art comes from and touches peoples souls.

ngl, Im often in a stoned trance when making music, I zone out and let the music make itself. Then my logical self comes in to do the mixing adjustments.
Im not a left or right mind thinker, Im both. I find production satisfies my need to be creative, and the mixing satisfies the logical side of my brain. I find music very satisfying lol.

 

[thedreampolice]

But certainly you have to imagine the sound you are going for in your mind first. Then you can translate it to your “soul” which isn’t very well defined in this particular discussion. My larger point is that your sound comes from you. Not your gear.